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May 31[edit]

Premature Algeria geography categories[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Upmerge. 50 to 60 is the generally-accepted minimum for a stub category. Non-admin closure. — This, that, and the other (talk) 10:45, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Not that I really like flooding the parent category even more, but creating premature categories is not the answer. Propose upmerging:

Dawynn (talk) 20:20, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Premature Iranian county categories[edit]

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the stub template and/or category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the template's or category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was Upmerge all except Cat:Sarbisheh County geography stubs, which has now 272 pages. 50 to 60 is the generally-accepted minimum for a stub category. (NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 11:21, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose upmerging the following:

No prejudice against recreating categories once templates filled. Dawynn (talk) 20:10, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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People by categorization, pre-1XX0 birth stubs[edit]

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the stub template and/or category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the template's or category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was Relist discussion to Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2012_July_22#People_by_categorization.2C_pre-1XX0_birth_stubs. (NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 13:04, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


I propose upmerging the following categories:

Rationalles:

  1. The question of which decades have enough stubs for their own categories is, in my opinion, too fluid to keep renaming these categories all the time.
  2. Frequently, these categories end up being too small and being upmerged anyway; I see no reason to keep a few of these arouind.
  3. Decades in the middle, or even recent decades, may end up requiring upmerging; I see no reason why being "old enough" is a justification for havin g a category.
  4. Some times there are cases where the year of birth is definitely earlier than the specified year, but is unknown; such people would end up in the parent category, not here.

עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 13:43, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not going to comment on the other sports, but the Australian rules stub cat is very nicely balanced, with 125 articles in the pre-1880 cat, which matches the size of most of the other pre-1970s cats, so your point 2 doesn't apply. There are no "middle decades" missed, so point 3 is moot too. The advantage of NOT upmerging is that the Category:Australian rules biography stubs is left with only people that we DON'T know the DOB of. It's a very useful distinction (I've just noticed a bunch of umpires in the parent stub cat, checked a recent season guide book, and their DOBs are all there). The-Pope (talk) 14:54, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, in the Australian rules category, 104 have the 1870s tag, which leaves 18 stubs for the pre-1870 - an excelent example of point 2. And Dave Boyd, an active player in 1870, would need to be in a pre-1870 category, if we had one, as he was an active player in 1870 - an example for #3. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 16:23, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, Dave Boyd played in the 1940's and 1950's, so was probably born in the 1920's. But your point stands in that AFL stubs are lacking a tag which directly adds to the pre-18X0 category. The reason I like having the category is first to keep unknown birth year separate, and secondly because it does refer to the era of the sport's development (1859-1880 or so). --Qetuth (talk) 06:42, 1 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I still think that having by all articles with known birth dates in by decade or pre-decade stub cats, and only unknown birthdates in the parent stub cat is useful, and unlike AFDs, it's useful should count here. If you want to extend it by one decade to pre-1870s that's about the limit of most known football history. We are unlikely to bring the numbers down dramatically in the near future, as we still have over 6000 known notable players left to create. The-Pope (talk) 16:14, 1 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Having looked around other categories to see why this isn't more widespread, I noticed that most other decade of birth stub categories have a parent category on century to be upmerged into, keeping them seperate fom unsorted/unknown. It doesn't help for the American ones, but the other three could perhaps benefit from this? (Example: Cat:American journalist, 20th century birth stubs and Cat:American journalist, 19th century birth stubs). --Qetuth (talk) 13:31, 2 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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May 29[edit]

{{WaynesboroVA-geo-stub‬}}[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete in the absence of any opposition. (NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 13:08, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Unused. Populates ‪Category:Shenandoah Valley, Virginia geography stubs‬, which is populated by several stub templates. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 20:11, 29 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

An example of an article which could use this may be Basic City, Virginia. Also, there are several NRHP pages from within Waynesboro - NRHP usually upmerges to -geo, as illogical as that sometimes is compared to -struct. Generally when a region is split by upmerged county templates, you would expect every county to be there, but this is an odd situation in that Waynesboro is not a county, but nor is it considered part of any county? Undecided...--Qetuth (talk) 02:30, 30 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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{{‪WinchesterVA-geo-stub‬}}[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete. Unused; narrow scope; alternative available; consensus to delete. Non-admin closure. — This, that, and the other (talk) 10:49, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Moving from TFD. Rationale was "Unused stub template with a very narrow scope. Winchester Va is a pretty small place with very few articles that would ever apply." It should also be noted that this populates ‪Category:Shenandoah Valley, Virginia geography stubs‬, which is populated by several stub templates. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 20:11, 29 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Delete; If Winchester is the county seat of Frederick county, shouldn't it use {{FrederickVA-geo-stub}}? --Qetuth (talk) 02:36, 30 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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May 28[edit]

{{Fem-stub}} / {{Fem-activist-stub}}[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Rename. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 08:53, 6 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose renaming to Template:Feminism-stub (currently a redirect) and Template:Feminism-activist-stub. The current template titles are ambiguous abbreviations, since 'fem' could just as easily denote 'female'. The template's history itself serves as proof of this potential for confusion: when it was created in November 2004, its text referred to "article about a female-related topic", and it was three months later that the text was changed to "feminism-related article". I'm unsure whether the current titles should be kept as redirects: combined, the two templates have only about 200 transclusions, so replacement would be fairly simple (I could do it). -- Black Falcon (talk) 23:58, 27 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Rename both, but may as well keep reversed redirect. No real advantage to being that terse. --Qetuth (talk) 03:34, 30 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rename both and keep the Fem variations as redirects. Gobōnobo + c 18:36, 5 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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May 16[edit]

Cat:Argentine winter sports biography stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete category and upmerge template. (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 12:00, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose delete category, upmerge template. Premature. I tried to fill but could only find 25. No prejudice against recreation once articles found. Dawynn (talk) 12:45, 16 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:American football defensive back, 1990s birth stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete category and upmerge template. (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 12:00, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose delete category, upmerge template. Premature. No prejudice against recreation once article count established, but right now, there are only 25 articles. After all, the oldest players in this group are only just past college age right now. The youngest are still in middle-school. Dawynn (talk) 12:09, 16 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Sri Lanka hospital stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete category and upmerge template. (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 12:00, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose delete category, upmerge template. Only 24 non-list articles in the permcat. Premature. Dawynn (talk) 12:09, 16 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Qods County geography stubs‎[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete category and upmerge template. (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 12:00, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose delete category, upmerge template. Only 9 articles in the permcat. Very premature. Dawynn (talk) 11:24, 16 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Mauritius building and structure stubs‎[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete category and upmerge template. (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 12:00, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose delete category, upmerge template. Only 17 articles in the permcat. Very premature. Dawynn (talk) 11:23, 16 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Delete and upmerge all of the above (May 16 proposals). --Qetuth (talk) 03:36, 30 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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May 15[edit]

Cat:Coalition Avenir Québec, Quebec MNA stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete category and upmerge template. WP:SILENCE (NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 11:13, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Premature. Delete category, upmerge template. Only 9 articles currently in the permanent category. Dawynn (talk) 17:47, 15 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Rhodesia stubs / {{Rhodesia-stub}}[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete Cat:Rhodesia stubs, upmerge {{Rhodesia-stub}} and replace and delete {{rhodesia-history-stub}}. (NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 12:49, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Delete as this project does not create stubs for disputed geopolitical entities. Dawynn (talk) 15:55, 15 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

See previous deletion discussion. Dawynn (talk) 15:56, 15 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete the category, but (weak) keep the template for potential use in the future. I think that an exception might be warranted for Rhodesia due to the duration and historical and political significance of its de facto existence. However, I support the nomination since the number of articles is far below the required threshhold of 60. The subcategory, Cat:Rhodesia history stubs also should be eliminated, and {{Rhodesia-history-stub}} should be replaced with {{Rhodesia-stub}}. Incidentally, shouldn't the affected articles be moved into Category:Zimbabwe stubs or its subcategories? -- Black Falcon (talk) 06:34, 21 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete both categories and {{rhodesia-history-stub}}, and upmerge or redirect {{Rhodesia-stub}}. History only has 2 articles, one of which isn't really a stub. --Qetuth (talk) 04:26, 30 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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Cat:Azawad stubs / {{Azawad-stub}}[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete. Clear consensus. Non-admin closure. — This, that, and the other (talk) 10:16, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Delete as this project does not create stubs for disputed geopolitical entities. Dawynn (talk) 15:55, 15 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Chilean winter sports biography stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Upmerge. Per nom. WP:SILENCE. Non-admin closure. — This, that, and the other (talk) 10:54, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Delete category, upmerge template. I couldn't even push this up to a dozen. The article count just isn't there. Dawynn (talk) 13:48, 15 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Indian women stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Delete. Consensus below; only one member. Simply not needed. Non-admin closure. — This, that, and the other (talk) 10:24, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose delete, appropriate retags for any affected articles. Category is unproposed, and sets an uncomfortable precedent. To my knowledge, we do not have any such high-level split by gender. Precedent is that first split under nationality (or region) is occupation. Breaking by gender immediately after nationality, especially for such a populous country is begging to create an overpopulated category. Dawynn (talk) 11:54, 15 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

  • ""KEEP"" - eventhough there are no high level gender splits, there is a need for recognition for an Indian women , as they were societaliy put down in the past century, and any contribution by Indian women becomes an excellent chronology of their current importance. Shrikanthv (talk) 13:01, 16 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
    That may be, but a stub type is not an appropriate vehicle for accomplishing the goal of providing "recognition for Indian women". Stub types are editorial tools to facilitate the sorting and expansion of short articles (see Wikipedia:Stub#Guidelines). -- Black Falcon (talk) 06:22, 21 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - An intersection of nationality and gender is not useful except as a container for further subdivisions involving gender, nationality and (probably) occupation. This road, unfortunately, leads to the troubled waters of categorization by gender: for most countries and occupations, gender will be irrelevant, especially as it relates to stub sorting. Ultimately, I think that splitting by gender will lead to a more complex stub system with little additional benefit. -- Black Falcon (talk) 06:22, 21 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete Such recognition would be better done through a 'History of' article or a list - By definition, a stub category should not have all the articles its name describes because at least some should be above stub class. Also, many groups across the world have been socially repressed, this does not imply membership in a group is a defining trait or part of what makes a member notable. So such categories should be restricted to pioneers and activists or they lose meaning. --Qetuth (talk) 09:18, 30 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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May 14[edit]

Cat:Rhodesia history stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was upmerge, category contains only one article. (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 11:46, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose upmerge. Category created way too early. Even upmerging to both parents leaves the parents themselves severely undersized. Dawynn (talk) 12:48, 14 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Worth noting that Rhodesia was always an unrecognized states. This project does not support unrecognized geopolitical entities. Dawynn (talk) 15:59, 15 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Upmerge to Zimbabwe history D O N D E groovily Talk to me 15:31, 3 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Rhodesia wasn't unrecognised as an entity — everyone said either that it was an established British colony or that it was an independent country. Both independent countries and colonies can get stub categories. Nyttend (talk) 20:38, 24 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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Cat:U.S. Open (golf) stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Upmerge. WP:SILENCE (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 11:52, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose upmerge. According to page history comments, category has been depopulated as articles moved from Stub to Start. Dawynn (talk) 12:24, 14 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Belfast geography stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Upmerge. WP:SILENCE (WP:NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 11:52, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Propose upmerge. Was of an appropriate size back in 2008, but has outlived that. Now only has 26 articles, and that's being generous. Dawynn (talk) 11:32, 14 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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May 7[edit]

Cat:2010s pop song stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Upmerge without prejudice to recreation when 60 transclusions are reached. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 08:17, 6 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Delete - as per Proposals, premature; 3 transclusions, 29 articles in permcat. Delete without prejudice to recreation when 60 transclusions are reached. SeveroTC 08:58, 7 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Cat:Algeria school stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Upmerge until there are at least 60 stubs for this category. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 06:42, 16 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Delete - unproposed, no problem with an upmerged template but 2 transclusions and 3 articles in permcat shows just how premature a stub category is. SeveroTC 08:58, 7 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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May 6[edit]

Women's history stubs[edit]

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The result of the discussion was Relisted at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2012_July_22#Women.27s_history_stubs. (NAC) Armbrust, B.Ed. WrestleMania XXVIII The Undertaker 20–0 12:58, 22 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Unproposed and badly formed template, and with the estimation of capturing 4,000 articles. I'm not particularly opposed to splitting along the line of women's history, but a category which holds 4,000 articles isn't useful. A request was filed at Wikipedia:Bot requests#Bot for Women.27s History project stubs to tag all articles within Cat:Stub-Class Women's History articles - perhaps a misunderstanding of the different uses of the two systems. What to do is not obvious. If there can be appropriate splits found, then I'd be happy with keeping this template and category as a parent with cub categories below. If we are to keep this template, then at least it needs to be renamed to {{womens-hist-stub}}. If there are no apparent splits, then I don't think this type is useful beyond the already existing splits by nationality and profession. SeveroTC 15:10, 6 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

As the person who created this stub template, I don't have a problem with whatever you do to correct this. All aspects of this, including my bot request, have been a misunderstanding. But I want you to know, I didn't just wake up one day and decide to go off and create all these things. I was pointed that direction by some very well-meaning editors who thought they were helping.
My original intent was to set up a Tedder bot to daily generate a list of new articles created for WikiProject Women's History. That's how this began, but it was difficult to get any information on how to do this. Tedder can't set up a bot without search terms, etc. etc. And so I began searching for someone to get this done, mostly not finding answers or even replies.
I had been advised by an experienced editor to create such a stub, as a way to find new articles for a Tedder bot for WikiProject Women's History. I was completely unaware that stub templates needed to be proposed and approved. I had also been advised to run an AWB after the template was created. I don't deal with AWB, so I input a bot request.
The creation of the category was proposed by another editor who said this could correct it. Two different editors telling me two different things that both felt would have been correct. Finger pointing after the horse ran out of the barn isn't the answer. All I wanted - really - was somebody to set up an automated daily Tedder bot so that project could see a daily list of new articles created. My intent, like theirs, was to do something good for that project. This has taken on a life of its own, but we need to get all this corrected, as cleanly and quickly as possible. Maile66 (talk) 11:54, 7 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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