This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

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Welcome!

Hello, NikoSilver/Archive 1, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Where to ask a question or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! Latinus 12:39, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

bravo

Pes ta re NikoSilver!O dialogo sas sto fyrom-discussion itan poly endiaferon.Den kseroun ti na poun oi skopianoi.Aporw an auta pou lene ta pisteuoun kai oi idioi...--Makedonas 22:16, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Me oli tin propaganda pu ehun akusi, ta pistevun! Latinus 22:19, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Kati tu 'pa tora - pes mu, tu tin ipa? :-P --Latinus (talk (el:)) 22:37, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

Xello! Pos sou fenetai etsi opos sou ta vala? vasika mi nomizeis oti kserw pos mpenoun-peiramata kanw mexri na to petyxw:). an de s'aresei pes na sou ta alaksw. Stous akatanomastous mia xara ta les, opou mporw grafw ki egw. Exthes enas akatanomastos evgale nea etymologia tis makedonias. vlepe sizitisi sto macedonia (region)...theloume kalyteri organwsi mallon emeis giati droume atomika enw oi alloi an deis tis sizitiseis toys synenoountai...ta leme...--Makedonas 15:14, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Xaxaxa:)))))!!!Poly kalos! Na kanoume ena diagonismo! H kalyteri etymologia kerdizei...:) Oi dikes sou itan safws kalyteres apo tou akatanomastou.--Makedonas 17:14, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Asfalws tha prepei na sou po kai ta dika mou bravo!!!fantazomai oti sou pire pollu xrono gia na sygentroseis afta ta stoixeia,alla pistepse me,ekanes kali douleia!tha ithela na ta do ola afta edited stin kentriki selida Macedonians (ethnic group),alla dustuxws,kapoios that to epanaferei stin propaganda... anyway...kai pali bravo:)--Hectorian 13:17, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Ριπαμπλικ οφ Μασεντονια

Γεια σου Νικολα. Σε καμια περιπτωση δεν ειπα οτι κανεις λαθος να υπερασπιζεσαι την ελληνικοτητα του Μεγαλεξαντρου ή του ονοματος της Μακεδονιας. Απλα ειναι μια κουβεντα που επειδη ενεχει μεσα της εθνικες (ή και εθνικιστικες πολλες φορες) συνιστωσες συνθηθως δεν βγαζει πουθενα και πολλες φορες δεν εχει νοημα. Λεω οτι δεν εχει νοημα με την εννοια οτι οταν οι συνομιλητες εχουν μεσα τους μπετοναρισμενη ο καθενας τη δικια του αληθεια, δεν προκειται με κανενα διαλογο να την αλλαξουν γνωμη και καταληγει ο διαλογος να ειναι παραλληλοι μονολογοι. Γιαυτο και προσπαθησα ετσι να δωσω μια πιο καθολικη αποψη, οτι δηλαδη μετα απο 3000 χρονια ολοι απογονοι του Μεγαλεξαντρου ειμαστε, οποτε μην τρωγομαστε. Τωρα για την παραχαραξη της ιστοριας το μονο που εχω να πω ειναι οτι προσωπικα πιστευω οτι η ιστορια ειναι ενα μπερδεμενο και πολυχρωμο κουβαρι απο ιστοριες και οτι η πραγματικη αληθεια της ισως να μην εχει τοσο σημασια για εμας εδω και τωρα, οσο το τρεχοντα γεγονοτα της ιστοριας που γραφεται αυτη τη στιγμη. Παντως, δεν εχω καμια διαθεση να μπλεχτω στο wikiwar για την ονομασια της fYRoM. Η δικη μου γνωμη ειναι οτι θα επρεπε να ειχαμε δεχτει την ονομασια "Βορεια Μακεδονια" οταν ειχε προταθει. Απο εκει και περα οι επιλογες των δυο αστικων κομματων ηταν που φερανε τα πραγματα εδω που ειναι τωρα και σαν αριστερος δεν προκειται να σκοτιζομαι για να υπερασπιστω τις επιλογες τους. -- Michalis Famelis 21:51, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Δεν νομιζω οτι χρειαζεται καποια "διευκρινιστικη δηλωση", κατω απο οσα εγραψα. Δεν εγραψα κατι που να στηριζει τις αποψεις των οποιων εθνικιστων. Και βασικα δεν νιωθω καθολου ανετα με αυτην την προταση σου:

Τί κάνουμε? Τον αφήνουμε έτσι, να νομίζει οτι υπάρχουν κάποιοι από εμάς που αλληλοτρώγονται για μικρο-ιδεολογικές τοποθετήσεις και παραγνωρίζουν το όποιο εθνικό συμφέρον τους ή τους τη λέμε όλοι μαζί?

Αρνουμαι να μπω στη λογικη "εμεις οι αποδω, εσεις οι αποκει". Δεν ειμαι στη wikipedia ουτε για να υπερασπιστω τα εθνικα συμφεροντα της Ελλαδας, ουτε για να τη λεω σε κανεναν. -- Michalis Famelis 23:13, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Kita

Ya, boris na rihnis mia matia sta Macedonians (ethnic group) ke List of Macedonians (ethnic group) pu ke pu? Enas ap' aftus vazi sinehia anoisies. --Latinus (talk (el:)) 22:01, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Greek words in English

Any dictionary-based study (like the counter-study on the Talk page) has the same bias. It talks about the number of words, not about their frequency of use. As for the French vs. Greek business, yes, many words came through French from Greek, but then we can also trace many of them to Indo-European. Clearly the percentages should add up to much more than 100%: a word like "agony" is French and Greek and Indo-European in origin. Finally, this is all a silly game, as though somehow the proportion of words from Ancient Greek reflected well on you and me. I find it embarrassing. --Macrakis 02:34, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

Θα σε απαγοητεύσω, Νίκο· όχι μόνο συμφωνώ με τον Μακράκη, αλλά θεωρώ δεδομένο ότι η λέξη που μπαίνει στα αγγλικά μέσω των γαλλικών είναι πρώτα γαλλική και μετά απώτερη ελληνική ή ό,τι άλλο: το discotheque είναι πρώτα γαλλικό και σε ύστερη μοίρα ελληνικό, όπως και το paradise είναι πρώτα ελληνικό και σε δεύτερη μοίρα περσικό, και το «μουσαφίρης» είναι πρώτα τουρκικό και σε δεύτερη μόνο μοίρα αραβικό. Δηλαδή το να μην μετράμε την ντίσκο ως γαλλική λέξη, όσον αφορά την ιστορία της αγγλικής, το βρίσκω παραπλανητικό. Φιλολογία για το θέμα υπάρχει μπόλικη, αλλά όλη μαστίζεται από τα ίδια μεθοδολογικά προβλήματα... Opoudjis 03:27, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

apantisi

an milas gia tin istoria tis xwras twn patsavourwn(=akatanomasti) ginetai 3 seires anafora stin arxaia istoria tis perioxis opou autoi simera menoun. trwgetai genika auto giati meta ousiastika ksekinoun na grafoun apo to 1912... tes.pantwn. auto pou eida simera einai oti ekripsan oles tis photos me to agalma to alexandrou sti saloniki kai tis ksanaevala sti thessaloniki kai sto Macedonia (Greece). exe to nou sou mi tis vgaloun. episis an deis ti leei sti skopiani metafrasi tou Macedonia (Greece) tha patheis friksi:))). --Makedonas 15:17, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

apo pou eisai esy vre nick?--Makedonas 15:18, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Xellou. Egw fysika kai symfwnw me auto pou les, aplws den exw piges na ta ypostiriksw. an mporeis na vreis esy mesa! vevaia tha lysaksoune. Autoi pou kanoun provlima pantws einai oi metanastes tous stin ameriki apo oti katalava. (logiko oi skopianoi edw skylopinoun me auta tha asxolountai). an thes kamia voitheia gia tis epixirimatikes sou drastiriotitess stin perioxi pes mou. Auto to diastima den kanw tipota, giati perimenw na parousiastw to maio :( ta leme..--Makedonas 20:06, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Kalispera Nick. Vasika auto pou les einai efikto alla thelei kapoia swsti organwsi kai epeidi me ta minimata edw tha kataliksoume na to sizitame gia poly kairo, kai afou eimaste kai ellada mporoume kalytera na ta poume kai tilefonika gia na kanoume swsti douleia. den kserw an symfwneis...--Makedonas 22:57, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

My talk page

Geia sou Nikola.arxisa syzitisi sth discussion page mou gia tous ellhnes tou exwterikou,gia ton sunoliko arithmo twn ellhnon.tha itan exairetika indiaferon an suneiseferes ki esy.thanks--Hectorian 09:46, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

File

Geia sou. Eimai o: Asteraki

Tha ithela gia na eime eilikrinis,tin voithia sou,an kai den gnorizomaste!

Epidi exo poli doulia ( na xekiniso to arthro gia tin Elliniki Makedonia mas, stis: Italiki,Ispaniki,Araviki,Afrikaniki,Rosiki,Poloniki kai pai legontas.... , -exo idi grapsi stis:Elliniki kai agliki(komatia),germaniki(arketa... ,alla distixos einai prosorina blokarismeno....),Galiki,Lithuaniki,Astouriani,Daniki kai Lefkorosiki. ) Kai epidi den ksero kai toso kala... Italika, tha ithela an ginete....

-Otan grapso to arthro sta italika, na sou to stilo kai na to riksis mia matia kai na mou pis ean stekete gramatika kai simperasmatika!!!! Entaksi? Ti les?

Perimeno apantisi sou (tha xaro eilikrina... ) !!! --Asteraki 22:35, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

Ego eimai simfonos! ( Enimerose me!!! )

An thelis mporoume na organothoume sta sovara, apo opou kai na vriskomaste pagkosmios..... ( Elada,Usa,Australia,Germania,Canada.... )
Pia einai i gnomi sou? --Asteraki 16:54, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

Ela Niko

File eime simfonos me tin protasi sou!!! -Kai Bravo sou,eilikrina!!!

1.Perimeno nea apo esena gia tin organosi!!! (boro na voithiso (ksero kai alous 2-3 pou boroun na voithisoun,episis) !!!)
2.Des to mail mou sto:

el:Συζήτηση χρήστη:Αστεράκι sto thema GrekoMakedonski -paragrafos *2.

kai grapse mou gia tin organosi!!!

3.Apo apantisis kai stixia... ,kanena provlima! -Oti thelis,eimai edo!!!
4.Vevea exo distixos os megalo provlima : "Ton elaxisto elefthero xrono,logo epagelmatikon ipoxreoseon"
5.Boro na voithiso opoudipote!!!

Boris na elenxis,to italiko:Macedonia (Grecia) ? [1]

-Simiono oti den ksero Italika!

--Asteraki 21:04, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Efxaristo!!!!!!!! --Asteraki 22:35, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Ευχαριστώ, τα λες σωστά. Politis 17:17, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Antigrafein

Swsta. Oi Skopianoi mi exontas tipota allo na e pideiksoun kai exontas lysaksei apo to kako tous panw stin apelpisia tous na mas pane kontra exoun kanei selides gemates anekdota (kakogousta) kai keimena gia gelia kai gia klamata:)) sovarotis miden. auto enantion tous einai. Ara venomen kalws. I niki tha einai diki mas...Alwste eimaste oi prwtathlites eurwpis kai autoi mia proin dimokratia, katse prwta na ginoun nyn kai ta ksanaleme:)--Makedonas 08:49, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

Hi Niko,

I have made an estimation on Talk:English words of Greek origin and I would like your opinion on this.--Odysses 14:23, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

Αν αλλάξει το 12% μάλλον κάποιες έδρες θ'αρχίσουν να τρίζουν. Φοβάμαι πως έχουμε πέσει σ'ένα κατεστημένο που δεν αλλάζει. Είδες τι είπε ο γάλλος--Odysses 12:34, 22 February 2006 (UTC);

I guess you are right. Makedonec 11:20, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

Νίκο, δεν ξέρω πως μπορώ να βοηθήσω. Αν έχεις κάτι, πες μου.

Θα μπορούσε κάποιος με μητρική τα Αγγλικά να το συντάξει πιο σωστά από εμάς ίσως. --Odysses 13:18, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

Αγγλικό λεξιλόγιο

Μην περιμένεις να σε βοηθήσω να αυξήσεις τον αριθμό ελληνικών λέξεων στα Αγγλικά στα άρθρα αυτά. Δυστυχώς, το POV μου σε αυτό το θέμα είναι ότι τα Αγγλικά έχουν λίγες λέξεις ελληνικής (ή άλλης ευρωπαϊκής γλώσσας) προέλευσης και οι περισσότερες είναι Αγγλοσαξωνικής, Λατινικής ή Πρωτοϊνδοευρωπαϊκής προέλευσης (για εθνικιστικούς λόγους - είμαι μισός Άγγλος). Θα πάω στη βιβλιοθήκη το απόγευμα και θα δω τι ποσοστά μπορώ να βρω. Υπήρχε μια μελέτη της Αγγλικής γλώσσας του Πανεπιστημίου του Καίμπριτζ και σίγουρα κάτι θα λέει για την προέλευση το λεξιλογίου. Με τους Μακεδονιστές των Σκοπίων τι γίνεται; Τα έχω αφήσει προσωρινά αυτά τα άρθρα και ασχολούμαι με τα ελληνοτουρκικά - έχει έρθει μια που φαντάζεται ότι υπάρχουν ένα δισεκατομμύριο Τούρκοι στον κόσμο --Latinus 15:09, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

No need to envy me Niko, get your own barnstar :-) --Odysses 11:07, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Kάνε κλικ στο "beware" (hope it's my good sense of humor)

Βρήκες μήπως το βιβλίο του Kωνσταντινίδη; Εγώ όχι.

Υπάρχει και ένα βιβλίο της Αννας Τζιροπούλου – Ευσταθίου [2] που το έχω. Ισχυρίζεται ότι "αποδεικνύει Πως η Eλληνική Γονιμοποίησε τον Παγκόσμιο λόγο".

Υπάρχουν γιαυτό αντιφατικές κριτικές, καλές και κακές. Δεν το έχω αναφέρει ακόμα γιατί δεν δίνει συγκεκριμένα στατιστικά στοιχεία.

Oso afora to makedonia region, thelo na epanaferis afta. Mu thimizi afta pu itan grammena sta sholika vivlia ke den ine olo origial research - oso afora to Angliko lexiliyio: Gallikes lexis den enhlun emena i allus epidi Gallofones periohes itan (des Hundred Years' War) ke ine akoma (des Channel Islands) meros tis Anglias. I Ellada pote den itan. --Latinus 21:23, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Otan aitiologisis tin epanafora tu text, pes oti o Djassos ehi dikeoma na ta grapsi simfona me to Wikipedia:Be bold in updating pages ke oti afto pu ekane o Makedonets miazi me paraviasi tu Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers. Pes tu na pi ti ton enohli sti selida sizitisis. --Latinus 21:29, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Ευχαριστώ για το δωράκι το των Δαναών. Σας φοβάμαι δεόντως. :-) Lukas ^(T.|@) 08:43, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

NikoSilver is awarded the Barnstar of Diligence for his efforts to present a neutral point of view in a controversial area. --Latinus 16:02, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Ne, to ida - an iparksun adidrasis, min apandisis ke an ta xanazvisun, mi ta xanavalis. To kitaza htes ke pragmati ine POV, ala an yinete na to afisume kalos, ala mi to iperaspizomaste poli yati ine POV, pyon yelame? Pare ke ena asteraki ;-) --Latinus 16:50, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

Protino na min ksekinisis tetia psifo yati sigura tha apotihi. Na ksekinas psifus mono an ise siguros oti tha petihun. O kanonismos Wikipedia:Naming conflict lei oti prepi na hrisimopiume to onoma pu theli to kratos ke na vazume disambiguation. Ara "Republic of Macedonia" ine to mono onoma pu borume na hrisimopiiume. Ute "Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia", ute "Macedonia" sketo. --Latinus 16:02, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

YS - su evala afierosi ;-) --Latinus 16:02, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Hectorian

me ehoun eknevrisei oloi aftoi,kai gi' afto tha tous tin lew opote oi geloies theories tous mou ti dinoun.exeis dikio,tha prospathiso na grapso kati shetiko sti selida tous gia to onoma kai gia ti sxesi pou DEN exoun me ton...pappou!mono pou prepei na to epexergasto kala,etsi wste na min exoun kai polles dikaiologies na to diagrapsoun(les kai xreiazontai dikaiologies....)!asfalws,tha xreiasto ena polu kalo back up apo sena kai apo osous summerizontai tis idies,m' emas,apopseis.tha se eidopoiisw suntoma!:)--Hectorian 18:35, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

hehe!kali douleia!den nomizo na katalixoun kapou,mias kai exeis cited ola ta aparaitita gia to edit sou.molis prosthesa kati stin paragrafo istoria sti selida tous!:)rixto mia matia,kai koita ligo ti suntaxi,giati exo tin entupwsh oti den xrisimopoihsa swsta ti lexi 'exceed'...Anyway...isws that prepei na to epexergasto pio poly,alla as thewrisoume afto to edit ws ena 'test drive':na kopsoume antidraseis kai na doume ti tha skarfistoun pali--Hectorian 19:16, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

portal

Geia.eidate to portal pou ekanan gia tin "proin telos pantwn xwra" tous? Mipos tha eprepe na kanoume kati gia na allaksei to onoma giati autoi to onomasan sketo portal:Macedonia? An kserete kati sxetiko me to thema enomeroste me...thanks --Makedonas 01:59, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

Ontws o ektorianos ekane kali douleia. Anypomonw na dw tis prwtes antidraseis....--Makedonas 02:14, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

Sto Macedonia(region) grafei oti 'the Republic of Macedonia and Greece entered into an “interim agreement” in which the Republic of Macedonia agreed to remove any implied territorial claims to the greater Macedonia region from its constitution and to drop the Vergina Sun from its flag. In return, Greece lifted the blockade.'den that eprepe na yparxei ena link gi'afto?exo tin entupwsh oti evgalan ton hlio apo ti shmaia tous,alla oti den allaxan ta arthra tou syntagmatos tous gia edafikes diekdikiseis.an afto einai alhtheia,tha prepei na shmeiwthei,giati emeis fainomaste ws 'adikoi' kai aftoi oti ekanan polles 'paraxwrhseis'...Xereis kati parapano gia to thema afto?--Hectorian 22:56, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Ekana kapoies mikroallages stin istoria meta ton WWII.rixto mia matia.the best with this user would be to ask him for the 'citations'.or we could go even further by editting whatever we like and ask 'citations' ourselves?!!!when i was reading that there is need for citations,i was thinking that what it is said is somehow accepted as fact,so i did not delete them.if noone provides,i will delete the claims myself...not cause of nationalism,but cause of accuracy.oso gia ta arthra tou syntagmatos tous,eixa diavasei oti miloun gia 'alutrwtismo'...tha psaxw,kai an ta vro,tha prosthesw links,eite ws kati pou akoma zitoun,eite ws kati pou zitousan(sto history section)--Hectorian 23:38, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

There are lots of English translations of the ROM's constitution on the Web. I don't know how accurate or up to date they are, but you might as well start there.... --Macrakis 00:28, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

RFAR

I filed a request for arbitration for the naming conventions of the Macedonia related articles: Wikipedia:RFAR#Macedonia_naming_dispute. I have listed you as a party involved. Bitola 14:48, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Niko, min pis tipota, as' ta na ta kano ola ego. --Latinus 15:45, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

portal:Macedonia

This portal name, insults all Macedonians in Greece, and makes problem bigger. STOP FYROM's PROPAGANDA IN WIKIPEDIA.--Makedonas 11:37, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

Βρήκες μήπως το βιβλίο του Kωνσταντινίδη;

Το βιβλίο της Αννας Τζιροπούλου – Ευσταθίου [3] σκέφτομαι να το παρουσιάσω. Ποια η γνώμη σου;

Dear Никола, as first it is not polite to talk to me through the Latinus talk page, if you have something to tell me, say it on my talk page. As the second, please understand that I don't want to discuss with you, unless you correct the tone of your voice and stop with the offenses and treats you are delivering to me from the beggining of our conversation. Bitola 12:00, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Hey, how you are doing Николче! I’m not in any way disappointed by the results on RFAR and renaming pool (I actually expected that outcome). And to tell you the truth, I’m quite pleased that the level of discussion between the editors of Macedonia related articles is improved in the last few months. In the following weeks I will be not so active on WP, so see you later… Bitola 19:37, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Hi

Please see Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Macedonia if you can. --Latinus 12:44, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

lol:).basika molis mbika spiti,but anyway....good timing!!!ekana ena sxolio sto talk page.an zitisoun apodeixeis,giati ekei odigw etsi pws kataligw,tha zitisw na perilifthei i katapliktiki douleia pou ekanes kai mazepses oles tis anafores twn arxaiwn hmwn gia tin ellhnikotita twn makedonwn.cheers!--Hectorian 14:24, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

))thanks for the ΒΡΑΒΕΙΟΟΟΟΟΟΟΟΟΟ!twra teleftaia ta exw valei me ta arthra sxetika me ta ellhnotourkika...elpizw na mporeseis kapoia stigmi na boithiseis ekei...--Hectorian 15:03, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

De sto ipa ;-) As' tus na skapsun to lako tus, ke emis na kathomaste ke na vlepume... --Latinus 15:52, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Deftero

NikoSilver is awarded this The Working Man's Barnstar for his efforts to present reliable sources in a controversial area--Hectorian 16:29, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

sou eipa gia ti douleia pou eixes kanei gia to sungekrimeno arthro kai tis piges pou vrikes...to axizeis me to parapanw!btw,koita to elektr.taxud. sou--Hectorian 16:29, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Boh8eia.

Xreiazome boh8eia sto ar8ro gia thn arxaia makedoniki glossa. Den mporw na 3anakanw epanafora. Boh8eia. --Asteraki 20:21, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Sockpuppets

Ya, eho zitisi apo tus diahiristes na kanun erevna sta IP tu makedonets exi pende tessera ke ston andropolus (LOL - orthografia!). Se ligo ola tha ta mathume ke tha fane frages. --Latinus 01:02, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

Philhellen

To eida,kai skeftika na pw oti axizes me to parapanw to vraveio gia 'reliable sources':)o,ti exei sxesi me arxaious suggrafeis prepei na vrisketai sta arthra!ekana ki egw mia mikroallagoula sti selida gia to ethnic group tous,gia na metriasw ti xrisi tou prwtou sunthetikou tou onomatos pou eixan(compare tis ekdoxes gia na katalaveis ti ennow).idiaitera me apasxoloun ta arthra gia tous eks anatolwn geitones...ta koitaw sunexeia kai vlepw oti theloun douleia(according to us pantote!)...alla fovamai pws an allaxw kati tha ginei xamos...--Hectorian 22:10, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

Το είδα και είναι καλό. Εγώ το βλέπω POV και δεν ασχολούμαι.

Θέλω να σου δείξω όμως ένα λεπτό, αδύνατο σημείο τους. Είναι η μάχη στο Κλειδί και γενικότερα εκείνη η εποχή. Από τη μια ο Βυζαντινός αυτοκράτορας και μάλιστα της Μακεδονικής δυναστείας. Από την άλλη ο Βούλγαρος βασιλιάς. Το ερώτημα που νομίζω θα τους δυσκολέψει είναι. Αυτοί με ποιους ήταν τότε; Με τους Βυζαντινούς Μακεδόνες ή τους Βούλγαρους; Τι θα απαντούσαν άραγε; Ή τότε μιλούσαν Ελληνικά και όχι Βουλγάρικα όπως σήμερα;--Odysses 18:16, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Philhellenism

Thanks for the support, although I don't think that the views of Sept(...) are something to be worried about. He's not exactly what I'd call a sympathiser of Greek people. Miskin 10:37, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Paraklisis

File, eimai Ellinas (opos kai esi fisika) kai xriazomai afti tin stigmi ti politimotati voithia sou.

1.Stin Elliniki wiki kai sigekrimena, sto arthro: Makedonas, pou einai sxedon olo, diki mou dimiourgia kai tora iparxi ipopsifiotita gia diagrafi tou arthrou stin selida [[4]]

Se parakalo para poli, ean thelis vevea kai exis tin kalosini, na psifisis gia tin paramoni kai mi diagrafi tou arthrou. Sigekrimena stin selida [[5]] na psifisis os exis:

διατήρηση και να μπει το πρότυπο {{disputed}}. ας αφήσουμε όποιον θέλει να το προχωρήσει. --Onoma

Diladi diatirisi, ... kai to onoma sou, opos parapano!

2.Stin Germaniki wiki kai sigekrimena, sto arthro: Elliniki (Proto-Elliniki) Glossa, pou einai olo, diki mou dimiourgia kai tora iparxi ipopsifiotita gia diagrafi tou arthrou stin selida 21.Hellenische Sprachen

Se parakalo para poli, ean thelis vevea kai exis tin kalosini, na psifisis gia tin paramoni kai mi diagrafi tou arthrou. Sigekrimena stin selida 21.Hellenische Sprachenna psifisis os exis:

Natürlich behalten --Onoma

Diladi , fisika diatirisi (=Natürlich 'behalten) kai to onoma sou, opos parapano!

Y.G. Ean thelis, mporis na metavivasis tin paraklisi mou, se alous filous kai empistous Ellines opos kai esi?

Parakalo pliri exemithia kai mistikotita! (Apefthinsou mono se poli empista atoma.) Efxxaristo!

--Kamikazi2 12:56, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Hi, I really cannot understand what can I do for you

Do you want me to translate something from the source or what? --Komitata 23:34, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Epeigon (SOS)

Xriazome-aste ti voithia sou, giati apo oti eida kseris kalitera galika apo oti ego! Koita, to arthro afto exi protathi distixos, meta apo kapies diorthosis pou ekana, gia diagrafi: w:fr:Macédoine grecque.

Se parakalo voithise kai kane oti mporis gia na min diagrafi!!!! --84.164.207.72 19:20, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

Niko, kita edo. Ton blokarane - ego fteo, ton karfosa :-/ --Latinus 10:50, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

What is the procedure to ban these poor RoM fellows.

I understand that there are different POV, but to claim that Bulgarian and Macedonian are NOT mutually intellible is the craziest thing on Earth. We have no problem figthing in discussions over this questions in our own languages. May we ban temporarily these poor fellows? --Komitata 12:15, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Exo kanei ena edit sto talk page...as perimenoume ligo mpas kai vroume lusi mesw suzhthshs...an kai de nomizw...--Hectorian 20:40, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Niko, since you mentioned Bulgaromacedonian, I can tell you that seach term exists even in the most hardcore defenders of the "completely different" from Bulgarian - Macedonian language. Even the creator of the language itself - Blazhe Koneski, talked about it. I will cite it with pleasure:

"Macedonian and the Bulgarian languages. The Macedonian text-books are closely integrated with this move. We have already had the opportunity to see how K. Sapkarev, one of the most prominent text-book writers, had come close to the Macedonists position, though he had not decided to make the decisive transfer. The question of writing a Macedonian grammar did not mean for the Macedonists uncovering such characteristics of the “Macedonian dialects” as could be used for the construction of a “common language” but the laying a foundation for the new Macedonian literary language. It is clear how important effecting this purpose was for our further national development.", taken from here

"For example, Macedonian writer Partenij was striving for common language of the Bulgarians and the Macedonians that would have incorporated features of both languages." taken from here - as you can see even the creator admits "some writers from the Renaissance" wanted a common language. I think it is the perfect beginning of a new article Bulgaromacedonian or Macedobulgarian (I don't mind the order). Can we ask our friends from Skopje what exactly had the Father of the language in mind? Provide more info for this unsuccessful attempt - the Bulgaromacedonian language? --Komitata 23:06, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, I forgot this: "In the sixties of the last century two answers were proposed to the question what was to be the medium of instruction in Macedonian schools and what, accordingly, were to be the text-books used.

1) The introduction of a language common to the Macedonians and Bulgars, a common language but such as would represent a compromise, a mean of Macedonian and Bulgarian dialects.

2) The introduction of a purely Macedonian language because the Macedonians are not Bulgars, but separate people." [from the http://www.macedon.org/makedonika/supporting_docs/macedonian_renaissance.htm Father himself] --Komitata 23:10, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

I stepped humbly in ;-)

I pasted the above on the discussion. Do you believe me that I can dig arguments all night long? And without resorting to Bulgarian, Greek, Serbian or International sources..Just with their own stones. When this happens I begin to question my own beliefs - maybe I am completely blind on something else...--Komitata 23:49, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

As some of the ancient philosophers would say - you cannot know what you don't know - maybe you just wait for it to hit you on the head. It's just an observation of the human nature - how it's possible to live in denial of yourself and not notice it ;-) --Komitata 23:58, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

You mean, more arguments.. :)) Well, I claim for example that medieval heraldists often confused Macedonians and Bulgarians and practically gave the same historical coat of arms [6] ,[7]- a gold lion on red background (this is why they are stealing the Vergina sun - the gold lion would look even more funny), or I can provide you a HILARIOUS excerpt from the stenographic notes of the CREATION of the Macedonian Literary language (Which took 5 days to invent:))). But if one is not willing to admit that 1+1 are two, then what do we do :-) --Komitata 00:12, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Please help

Hi NikoSilver. I was wondering if you could please help me out on the Adana page. Some Turkish editor wants to remove the Greek name and a paragraph about the Adana massacre. Thanks. --Khoikhoi 02:34, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! Would you be able to keep an eye on it? I guarantee that the anon/anons will revert again when they get the chance. --Khoikhoi 08:55, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Good job so far. ;) --Khoikhoi 08:58, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

[[Image:Stop_hand.svg|left|30px]] Please see Wikipedia's [[Wikipedia:No personal attacks|no personal attacks]] policy: <span style="font-size: 120%"> '''There is no excuse for personal attacks on other contributors. Do not make them.'''</span> Comment on ''content'', not on the contributor; personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Note that you may be [[Wikipedia:Blocking policy|blocked]] for disruption. Please [[Wikipedia:Staying cool when the editing gets hot|stay cool]] and keep this in mind while editing. Thanks.

You have been reported here Wikipedia:Personal attack intervention noticeboard, under WP:NPA for personal attacks to Macedonian people. Makedonec 12:35, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Kane mu mia hari, kane anastrofi sto arthro ya to idioma tus - ton eho idi karfosi pu paravise ton kanonismo ;-) --Latinus 15:20, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Me prolabe o Ektwr. NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)} 15:31, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

hehe:)...mipws theleis na anastrepseis to Adana?egw den mporw...--Hectorian 15:34, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Tora boris? Ke min ksehasis na anaferis oti o protos proedros tus etsi to eleye. --Latinus 15:57, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Epitelous! Prolaba ki egw! NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)} 16:10, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Prosehe ton kanonismo - ishii ke se en meri epanafores. --Latinus 17:26, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Eipame. Ton 3erw kala. Edw teleiwnw gia shmera. Aytoi ton 3eroun? O 8odwrhs apo panw de3ia ti sou grafei sta akatalabistika? NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)} 17:28, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Tora hriazomaste ti simetohi su sto arthro ya to lao tus. --Latinus 18:22, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Boris na kanis epanafora sto Makedones (ethnikotita)? Su ehi mini mia... --Latinus 21:52, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Min kanis akoma - to prosthese enas ap' aftus. --Latinus 21:59, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Den kserume - aplos kserume oti ine sigura kaltsa epidi kseri na hrisimopii ti Wikipedia. Kata ti gnomi mu omos, den ehi simasia epidi den editari ta arthra. Na ton karfosume otan arhisi na epanaferi tis ekdosis ton akatanomaston. --Latinus 22:00, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

oxi akoma - fylaxe to ya meta. Tora sizitame evesthita pragmata ke sigura tha se anaresun ke tha pai hameni. Episis an kanis epanafora, epanafere to stin teleftea diki mu ekdosi (ligotero pithano na mas anaresun). Pes mu ti tha kanis prin to kanis... --Latinus 23:40, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Endaxi - edo ine mia para ikosi. Ke ego tha figo se ligo. --Latinus 00:42, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Ta eho paratisi - afu den akune, den ehi noima na ashilise mazi tus. Eho ke alla arthra na grafo. Prospathisa na sizitiso me ton Bomac-o (kita mk:Корисник разговор:Boyan#Твойто блок ke mk:Корисник разговор:Латинец) ke epimeni oti de theli to Slavomakedoniko onoma sti selida. Tu ekana prosfores bolikes (p.h. na to anaferume me asteraki). Aftos den ithele. --Latinus 22:33, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Kane oti thes - ego protino na min to kanis, epidi sigura tha se anastrepsun ke tha ine tapinotiko na hasume to edit war. --Latinus 22:51, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Su estila e-mail. --Latinus 22:59, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Boris na prosehis to arthro ya tin poli monastiri. --Latinus 22:33, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

Nikola,mporeis na kaneis kati gia to parapanw arthro?--Hectorian 00:09, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Arghses... (koita tis wres...) NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)} 00:11, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

to xerw:p...to timing den itan kalo afti ti fora.--Hectorian 00:14, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Kita to e-mail su. --Latinus 00:28, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

tha to kaneis esu?--Hectorian 00:33, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Oxi, kati allo tu eho pi. --Latinus 00:38, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Re: translation

Although in this country there is no nationality other than the only Serbian and no religion other than Orthodox Eastern, still any foreigner and foreign citizen can freely live the same freedom and our homeland's rightiousness just as any Montenegrin or Hillsman alike does. --HolyRomanEmperor 20:32, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Macedonija - spelling

On your user page you propose "xxx Macedonija". I think this is inconsistent. It should be either "Makedonija" or (in English) "Macedonia". I suppose this is an oversight. Andreas 14:21, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Um, no it isn't - the Makedonija-Skopje proposal was the English name for the country. --Latinus 14:28, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

I am afraid you did not get my point. What I was wondering about is why you spell the word Macedonija with a "c" and a "j". The English spelling is "Macedonia" (with a "c" but no "j"), whereas the native spelling is "Makedonija" (with a "k" and a "j"). I would suggest that you erase the letter "j" from your infobox to be consistent with English spelling. Or did you intent to use the native spelling? Then the "c" should be changed to "k". Regarding the issue itself, I do not have a particular opinion, it seems to me that this is another one of these problems that have no obvious solution. Andreas 20:32, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Cyrillic k is always pronounced as k, look at Macedonian language#Alphabet. The 'c' spelling was introduced by the Romans, who later changed the pronunciation. See also Pronunciation of Celtic. Andreas 21:57, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Signatures code (for the record)

Feb 2006:
NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)}

Mar 2006:
NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)}

Apr 2006:
NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)}

Apr 2006 (v2) by Saxifrage (thanks)
NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)}

NikoSilver ^{(T) @ (C)} 23:52, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Frayes

O Makedonec ine gnostos hristis - eho ke tin ipopsia oti i Evreii ehun ke idiki metahirisi apo to Olokaftoma. Pernun ton anti simitismo sovara edo... --Latinus 23:03, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

To xerw,kai tin epomeni fora pou tha sunevaine(giati den nomizw aftos na stamitisei)tha zitousa voitheia...Exe to nou sou ki esy...--Hectorian 23:15, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Pos na se kalipso. Signomi - grafo ena arthro tora. --Latinus 23:28, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Kalo to 'logiko paradoxo',an kai den eimai kalos sta mathimatika(gia na eimai eilikrinis...ta suxainomai)!alla den nomizw na sumfwnisoun sto onoma slavomacedonians.gi'afto tha prepei mallon na kratisoume to ellhnes makedones...Ti les?--Hectorian 23:37, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

check your mail again--Hectorian 00:15, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Ellinika

You may be right in parts, thanks for the note. Still... "o ilithios"? Isn't that really more like "that idiot"? If you tell me no now, I'll remove the notice from Miskin's page before he sees it. - BTW, I left a note to Septentrionalis asking him to let your revert stand for the moment. Lukas ^(T.|@) 20:51, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Check your mail--Hectorian 21:31, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Well, as much as I don't like the idea of offending newbees, I just couldn't help myself. It was really very poorly formatted and very essay-like. I think dab's reaction was impulsive and derives from extensive edit warring. The current version is not perfect, but it is not bad either, plus it isn't far from most other ethnic group articles, and it has been "on air" long enough to wait a little longer in order to make it better, rather than worse.

Byz's content does not mean harm to the modern Greeks. However, in my mind, there is no dispute as to whether Greeks have a continuous history or not. History has shown that no ethnic group could ever possibly survive, without bonding with it's past, especially under various occupations. The Greek history is so long, that the occasional leaders would choose flashbacks from the past to make a point for the future, while abolishing the immediate past. I consider this totally unimportant. This length and flashbacks, make it so hard for ..."barbarians" to comprehend it's documented continuity. But, actually, it is the whole of this history that gets us going, so I like the resolution part.

There may have been Greeks against Greeks, against Persians, against Romans, against Byzantines, against Ottomans, and even today, there are Hellenes against Hellenes. You can see that even in wikipedia! Whichever the leadership and whatever its opposition, the Greek people always existed, otherwise many of us in this country would speak Italian, Slavic or Turkish, many of us would believe in Zeus or in Allah and there wouldn't be so many genetic similarities with our ancestors (if that is a science already).

Major historical changes (like city-states to Hellenic Empire, Romanisation, Christianisation, Schisma, Slavic Invasion, Ottoman Occupation and Palligennesia) can never be smooth. There's always been resistance to change, from inside or from outside. But, Greeks seem to have collective adaptation, despite being very stubborn people and unable to accept bossy behaviour (even from our own). At the same time, we are very innovative, inventive, well-intended (it's called "filotimo" (φιλότιμο) -and there is no translation for that), art and science-prone. I wish my knowledge in history was more adequate, in order to participate in your talk more effectively, but I was really very good in what Greeks call "positive" sciences, and I'd have to be schizophrenic to like history too. Who knows... it's never too late! NikoSilver ^(T)@(C) 23:10, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

OK - tha do ti boro na kano :-) --Latinus 23:25, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for the appreciation of my participation. Only, how much can I contribute to a debate that goes on for ever? (7 archives just for Talk:Macedonians (ethnic group)) Will it make a difference? On the other hand, the Macedonian debate is so civilized compared to others (see e.g. Sri Lanka), and compared to what it was at the turn of the 18th/19th centuries. A consolation is today's announcement of ETA that the armed struggle is to be abandoned. One thing I would like to say is: look around what is happening in this world, instead of finding fake arguments such as Slovenia-Veneto, or this: [8]. Instead, study the history of Alsace, Prussia, South Tyrol, the partition of Slovenia between Austria and Yugoslavia, etc. Read the book: Paris 1919 written by a Canadian historian. (Prussia, considered so much a German state, was named after a Baltic nation that the Germans then led to extinction). Andreas 17:10, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

peri onomatos

Einai apo ena biblio. Miskin 17:27, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
To onoma einai Rossiko kai kanonika grafetai Myshkin*. Den peirazei as'tous na nomizoun oti theloun. Poios pisteueis omos oti to nomizei auto? Miskin 17:39, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Blepe Prince Myshkin. Miskin 23:59, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Here we go again....

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Turkish Kurdistan - Bertilvidet 00:36, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Kane mu mia hari - kane epanafora sto arthro Dimokratia Makedonias. --Latinus 23:49, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Tha sou steilo il. tax. syntoma. Miskin 23:57, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Administrative roform in Greece

Niko, When I was young (this means, in the 1950's), I remember we had maps of Greece that were divided into:

Πελοπόννησος - Στερεά Ελλάς - Θεσσαλία - Ήπειρος - Μακεδονία - Θράκη - Κρήτη - and the Islands.

There must have been an administrative reform in Greece since than. I was living in Germany and then in Canada, so I did not find out when that happened, and now there are such regions like Ανατολική Μακεδονία και Θράκη. Can you find out when and why this change happened? Andreas 02:46, 26 March 2006 (UTC) See this] to see what I mean Andreas 02:54, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

What administrative reform? And what does administration have to do with anything? The same maps of Greece that you remember from the '50s, the same me and my dad were taught in school and I think the same applies today.

i.e. (copy/paste your's): Πελοπόννησος - Στερεά Ελλάς - Θεσσαλία - Ήπειρος - Μακεδονία - Θράκη - Κρήτη - and the Islands.

Now, if there's been some sort of change in administration with subdivisions etc, that's a different conversation. Isn't it? NikoSilver ^(T)@(C) 10:46, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Exactly. My 1974 German "Brockhaus" Encyclopedia mentiones that Greece was divided into 7 provinces since 1971. Today, there are 13 Περιφεριες, so something must have changed since. But look also at this: By a law of 27 November 1899, Greece, which had hitherto been divided into sixteen departments (v6uof) was redivided into twentysix departments, as follows: from Britannica 1911. Andreas 14:55, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Andrea, thanks for the great link! I had no idea about all this information being scanned and uploaded! Only problem is, the articles are HUGE.

Indeed there are 13 peripheries as you can also see at all statistical data of ESYE (National Statistical Service). I bet the "(v6uof)" is a bad scan for the Greek "(νομοί)" (perfectures). We now have 51 of them (so 26 sounds logical at the time).

The peripheries are not consistent with the traditional subdivisions we learnt in school. For example, Peloponnisos is divided to 2.5 peripheries (2 in whole and one in part with Sterea Hellas). Another example, Macedonia and Thrace are divided in 3 peripheries. I guess that is only for administration purposes, so that the "nomoi" are groupped 4 by 4 (or something) and has to do with nowdays roads, accessess, populations and size of main cities. In the example of Peloponnisos, the grouping of part of it with Sterea Hellas, sounds very practical, since I know for a fact that the metropolis of the area is Patras, (which appears almost in the center of the new administrative group), and the perfectures located North (in Sterea Hellas) pass the Rio-Antirio bridge.

From the talk with Realek, the above info seems redundant. He has no idea what he's talking about anyway... NikoSilver ^(T)@(C) 19:38, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Comment by Reaper7

Sorry I have just been banned by Yamia, apparently this Library Ip has had people do vandalism on it, oh well i tried, Reaper7 23:00, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Anoisies lei - den ine auto IP vivliothikis. To epsaksa... --Latinus 15:37, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

Margaritis calling

I just came from abroad and read your comments (to my suggested link). I am sorry that you misread me and took offence. We're a wikicommunity here and should not tease each other. But you really miss the point. What was really my point is Triaridis' text. See Niko, he's a fellow Greek of yours and you ought to take heed and really make an effort and try understand his excellent deconstruction of the phenomenon of the contemporary Greek nationalism. I'm not implying you're a sombre nationalist by default. But the more you will read of the likes of Triaridis the more you will understand of the Macedonian issue. And this applies to all of us. Apostolos Margaritis 16:48, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

BBC in Macedonian language

BBC in Macedonian

Wake up call for Nico: even the Beeb acknowledged THERE IS a Macedonian language! Apostolos Margaritis 16:52, 27 March 2006 (UTC)